Great Music

[Jazzman]

Jazz is just about the greatest music there is. There is such a wide variety of jazz. At times it’s real intense, other times it’s smooth, and others like you’re in an alien gateworld of your very own.
Jazzman

larri
mbers

[Coypu]

I think that jazz have some great elements like the freeform improvisation and alot of great musiciaship. The genre have a hard time covering some types of emotions like Despair, Hatred, Agony and not to mention just pure intensity and power. I think that Death Metal does a god job at this so giving the genre some props is never wrong. The jazz-death metal metal is amazing and I can recomend all people who like technical groundbreaking music to give it a try. The songs below are a form of jazz that is very uknown but very brilliant and I hope that some of you give it a try:

Textures (http://galaxen.net/~coypu/musik/MX/Cynic%20-%20Focus%20-%2007%20-%20Textures.mp3)

Water (http://galaxen.net/~coypu/musik/MX/Atheist%20-%20Water.mp3)

Bouncing in a bottomless pit (http://galaxen.net/~coypu/musik/MX/Fredrik%20Thordendal%20-%20Sol%20Niger%20Within%203.33%20-%2016.mp3)

[X-man]

there is a metal core type band called the dillinger escape plan and they fuse lots of jazz elements, the drummer is pretty crazy, they blast sometimes, and have weird spontaneous bits, its loud, this is more on the rage side of emotion and has power and intensity.

a great song to download is '43% burnt'

they have recently released an EP with Mike Patton(faith no more, mr bungle, fantomas, tamohawk) on vocals. Some good songs on there like 'when good dogs do bad things'.

[Pharaohrock]

thanks.

[Coypu]

Originally posted by X-man
there is a metal core type band called the dillinger escape plan and they fuse lots of jazz elements, the drummer is pretty crazy, they blast sometimes, and have weird spontaneous bits, its loud, this is more on the rage side of emotion and has power and intensity.

a great song to download is '43% burnt'

they have recently released an EP with Mike Patton(faith no more, mr bungle, fantomas, tamohawk) on vocals. Some good songs on there like 'when good dogs do bad things'.

They are definately a really interesting band but I have alot of trouble getting into them. It feels like the music gets lost in the chaos at times. Have you heard Gorguts from Obscura and forward? They are in my opinion easily the best experimental band in extreme metal since while they are very chaotic their music is still musical.

[Spoon]

Obscura is a great album for anybody that can appreciate very well done experimental metal.

My main problem with metal in general these days is the pure lack of creativity. Sure there are plenty of very talented musicians that play death metal, but finding the next Gorguts can be a tough thing. Most of the new stuff can be described as either "Sounds like Carcass mixed with..." or "Sounds like Suffocation mixed with...".

I love to spin a CD thirty times and hear something new which is why I'm in love with jazz. You can't say that for big name metal bands like Vomitory, Incantation, Mortician or just about the entire Razorback Records catalog (although the new Gruesome Stuff Relish is nothing short of brilliant).

[Coypu]

Originally posted by Spoon
Obscura is a great album for anybody that can appreciate very well done experimental metal.

My main problem with metal in general these days is the pure lack of creativity. Sure there are plenty of very talented musicians that play death metal, but finding the next Gorguts can be a tough thing. Most of the new stuff can be described as either "Sounds like Carcass mixed with..." or "Sounds like Suffocation mixed with...".

I love to spin a CD thirty times and hear something new which is why I'm in love with jazz. You can't say that for big name metal bands like Vomitory, Incantation, Mortician or just about the entire Razorback Records catalog (although the new Gruesome Stuff Relish is nothing short of brilliant).

I think that most genres have the problem that only a handfull bands and artists really try to create something new and amazing, even jazz have loads of bands who create nothing new and just play it standard. Death Metal do have alot of unortiginal bands but once you find the good ones it really is worth it. Atheist, Meshuggah, Cynic, Theory In Practice, Red Tide, Nocturnus, Lethargy, Cenotaph(mex), Pestilence ... There is plenty if you look hard. And just look at Technical Metal alá Spastic Ink, Watchtower, Spiral Architect and similar, thoose bands are truly amazing. My point is that if you search you will find plenty inside metal.

[X-man]

Originally posted by Coypu


They are definately a really interesting band but I have alot of trouble getting into them. It feels like the music gets lost in the chaos at times. Have you heard Gorguts from Obscura and forward? They are in my opinion easily the best experimental band in extreme metal since while they are very chaotic their music is still musical.

haha even they say themselves that its hard to get into the music, they're pretty insane live.

[Spoon]

Originally posted by Coypu


Atheist, Meshuggah, Cynic, Theory In Practice, Red Tide, Nocturnus, Lethargy, Cenotaph(mex), Pestilence ... There is plenty if you look hard. And just look at Technical Metal alá Spastic Ink, Watchtower, Spiral Architect and similar, thoose bands are truly amazing. My point is that if you search you will find plenty inside metal.

Atheist, Meshuggah, Pestilence, and Watchtower started in the late 80's. Cynic and Nocturnus started in the early 90's. They are heavily borrowed from and copied by other bands. In their prime they were wonderful and innovative, but now they are all just part of the pack.

Theory In Practice, although newer, is standard techinical death metal from Sweden with stereotypical tempo changes a-plenty.

Lethargy is just another technical death metal band. Kelliher and Dailor made the right move by joining Mastodon.

Cenotaph's early stuff is just another muddy, brutal death metal band. Nothing special here. As they progressed they turned into a more melodic At The Gates-like band. I wouldn't consider anything Cenotaph has done groundbreaking, even for being early 90's death metal.

Spiral Architect sounds too much like Watchtower mixed with Cynic, but the vocals are amazing. Still, nothing new and innovative.

Red Tide is actually an innovative band worthy of mention. I wish they put out more than one album, though. Good call.

Spastic Ink is another worthy band that makes Watchtower sound simplistic.

Plus all of these bands are rather mainstream with the exception of Red Tide and don't require much looking.

The reason why I like jazz so much right now is because I've listened to metal all my life. I'm 26 now, and there really isn't much tht I haven't heard. If a new band comes along that breaks boundries like Alien Crucifixion, then I'm happy somebody has added something new to metal. Basically, all the new stuff is just stuff I heard 10+ years ago, and I can't possibly put a good technical band over innovation and song writting ability.

I don't get that with jazz. I'm too new to jazz. Everything sounds new and complex. There's so many different styles and sounds. It's like a whole new world to me. I'm sure somebody that has never listened to much metal might think the same when they first start listening to it, but I feel there's just too much metal and not enough creativity.

[Coypu]

Originally posted by Spoon
Atheist, Meshuggah, Pestilence, and Watchtower started in the late 80's. Cynic and Nocturnus started in the early 90's. They are heavily borrowed from and copied by other bands. In their prime they were wonderful and innovative, but now they are all just part of the pack.

Theory In Practice, although newer, is standard techinical death metal from Sweden with stereotypical tempo changes a-plenty.

Lethargy is just another technical death metal band. Kelliher and Dailor made the right move by joining Mastodon.

Cenotaph's early stuff is just another muddy, brutal death metal band. Nothing special here. As they progressed they turned into a more melodic At The Gates-like band. I wouldn't consider anything Cenotaph has done groundbreaking, even for being early 90's death metal.

Spiral Architect sounds too much like Watchtower mixed with Cynic, but the vocals are amazing. Still, nothing new and innovative.

Red Tide is actually an innovative band worthy of mention. I wish they put out more than one album, though. Good call.

Spastic Ink is another worthy band that makes Watchtower sound simplistic.

Plus all of these bands are rather mainstream with the exception of Red Tide and don't require much looking.

The reason why I like jazz so much right now is because I've listened to metal all my life. I'm 26 now, and there really isn't much tht I haven't heard. If a new band comes along that breaks boundries like Alien Crucifixion, then I'm happy somebody has added something new to metal. Basically, all the new stuff is just stuff I heard 10+ years ago, and I can't possibly put a good technical band over innovation and song writting ability.

I don't get that with jazz. I'm too new to jazz. Everything sounds new and complex. There's so many different styles and sounds. It's like a whole new world to me. I'm sure somebody that has never listened to much metal might think the same when they first start listening to it, but I feel there's just too much metal and not enough creativity.

You can pick apart any band depending on your view. Sure Bach was good back in the day but now he is is just one among many...

My point was that there is and have been great talent and innovation in metal and anyone who looks will find it. I have myself listened to Focus a few hundred times and today I have gotten used to it and when I listen to some new jazz I also hear something different but in 10 years when you have heard thousands of jazz bands it will become the same there for you.

And yes there is a shortage in new creative and innovative bands in metal but all genres suffer from this, the more bands in a genre the harder to stand out from the pack. Where is the next Allan Holdsworth? Who will be the next Luc Lemay? I have no clue but I will keep looking until I find out.

And you say that Cynic and Atheist are among the pack now which i find abit odd since I have never ever heard a band who are similar to thoose. They are still unmatched and very unique and defianately not like Carcass who have 1000 clone bands for example.

[clifton]

Hey Jazzman, you nailed it.
Jazz is the most powerful music there is. Now I don't listen to a lot of fusion or electric jazz, I like it but as a matter of personal taste I'm a bebopper at heart. For the emotional intensity Coypu refers to, but with acoustic instruments, you might want to try "Ascension" by John Coltrane. Also "Free Jazz" by Ornette Coleman, which also has collective improvising but it swings harder and, at least to my ears, creates a sort of transcendent, ecstatic feeling. And without drugs! (if Ashcroft is monitoring this, I'm just kidding). I recommend anything by Charlie Parker as well, especially "Jazz At Massey Hall".

[Coypu]

Originally posted by clifton
Hey Jazzman, you nailed it.
Jazz is the most powerful music there is. Now I don't listen to a lot of fusion or electric jazz, I like it but as a matter of personal taste I'm a bebopper at heart. For the emotional intensity Coypu refers to, but with acoustic instruments, you might want to try "Ascension" by John Coltrane. Also "Free Jazz" by Ornette Coleman, which also has collective improvising but it swings harder and, at least to my ears, creates a sort of transcendent, ecstatic feeling. And without drugs! (if Ashcroft is monitoring this, I'm just kidding). I recommend anything by Charlie Parker as well, especially "Jazz At Massey Hall".

Jazz have its areas where the genre does things better than no other genre can BUT when it comes to expressing feelings of the more darker and aggressive nature you need to look elsewhere. I think that jazz and metal makes a very interesting combination because nomatter what you say jazz will never even be close to the aggression and power that extreme metal have. It's all about have a broad view. Don't bash it before you try you know..

example 1 (http://galaxen.net/~coypu/musik/MX/Cynic%20-%20Focus%20-%2005%20-%20Im%20But%20A%20Wave%20To.mp3)