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Thread: radio airplay versus youtube

  1. #16
    musician Jeff Smith's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    fringes of the jazz wasteland
    I live in the northeast usa, and even up here I can't count on turning on the radio and hearing any jazz, unless there happens to be a jazz program playing on a college or public radio station at the time. I get no 24 hour jazz radio.

    If that's the case in a huge market area like mine, I don't see radio as a very effective promotional tool. I definitely think that the internet is the main way for an artist to create a buzz. But, since there are 12 billion videos on youtube, it takes more than that to get noticed.

    If I had product (music) to market, I'd have video on Youtube, but I'd be trying to get the attention of online and print jazz journalists. I'd have my tracks for sale on itunes, Amazon, etc., through Tunecore, and I'd be submitting my tracks for inclusion with online music streaming services like Spotify, Pandora, Slacker, etc. Then you'd need at least a modest website to provide all the info and samples that a fan, journalist, venue or label would need to engage with you.

    Now you are ready to invest in endless hours of online social networking, and you'd be competing with every jazz musician from the last 100 years that still has product available to purchase. Miles, Coltrane, Mingus, Monk are dead but still move more product than most living artists. After all this, you'd wonder if you had time left to be a musician.

  2. #17
    Retired Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    great real deal info , jeff, i apreciete it, that kind of feedback is what im looking for, including the aside about if there is time to be a god, i was thinking just the other day how much energy and dedication it takes just to put an hour every day , i mean every day, for many many years ( far more than i care to admit here, beleive me ive been through the 3 to 6 hours aday and know , you kind of have to do that to get ready for long hour gigs) into practicing the instrument. i wish that was my job to do just that to prepare for the bandstand

    tpt1, yes, i also have learned peoples material , or a song to be done, from youtube

  3. #18
    Registered User Vaughan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Quote Originally Posted by good rhythms View Post
    vaughan, has youtube ever played into you getting an interest in the music of someone and leading you to buy their work?
    Yes it has. I was on a Classical site recently, and found an old thread about avant garde compositions with vocals. They're linked to 20 or so Youtube clips of pieces which I went through. I ended up buying three or four discs based on what I'd heard.

    As you all probably know, Youtube is constantly under legal threat about videos - here's a recent story:

    REUTERS - A U.S. appeals court dealt Google Inc (GOOG.O) a major defeat by reviving lawsuits by Viacom Inc (VIAB.O), the English Premier League and various other media companies over the use of copyrighted videos on Google's YouTube service without permission.

    The 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals on Thursday reversed a June 2010 lower court ruling in favor of YouTube, which had been considered a landmark in setting guidelines for websites to use content uploaded by users.

    "It's hard to characterize this as anything other than a loss for Google, and potentially a significant one," said Eric Goldman, director of the High Tech Law Institute at Santa Clara University School of Law. "It has given new life to a case that Google thought was dead."

    The $1 billion lawsuit filed by Viacom in 2007 to stop the posting of clips from "The Daily Show with Jon Stewart," "South Park," "SpongeBob SquarePants" and other programs addressed a crucial issue for media companies: how to win Internet viewers without ceding control of TV shows, movies and music.

    And a recent (April 20th) from Europe:

    YouTube could face a huge bill for royalties after it lost a court battle in Germany over music videos.

    A court in Hamburg ruled that YouTube is responsible for the content that users post to the video sharing site.

    It wants the video site to install filters that spot when users try to post music clips whose rights are held by royalty collection group, Gema.

    The German industry group said in court that YouTube had not done enough to stop copyrighted clips being posted.

    YouTube said it took no responsibility for what users did, but responded when told of copyright violations.

    "Today's ruling confirms that YouTube as a hosting platform cannot be obliged to control the content of all videos uploaded to the site," said a spokesperson for the video site.

    "We remain committed to finding a solution to the music licensing issue in Germany that will benefit artists, composers, authors, publishers and record labels, as well as the wider YouTube community," they added.

    Gema's court case was based on 12 separate music clips posted to the website. The ruling concerns seven of the 12 clips.

    If YouTube is forced to pay royalties for all the clips used on the site it will face a huge bill.

    Gema represents about 60,000 German song writers and musicians.

    If enforced, the ruling could also slow the rate at which video is posted to the site as any music clip would have to be cleared for copyright before being used.

    Currently, it is estimated that about 60 hours of video is uploaded to YouTube worldwide every minute.

    YouTube owner Google has yet to comment on the ruling.

    The court case began in 2010 and came after talks between YouTube and Gema about royalties broke down. In 2009, the stalemate meant that videos from German recording firms were briefly blocked on the site.

    Gema has rung up several victories against sites it has claimed are using music without paying royalties.

    In 2009, file-sharing site Rapidshare was told to start filtering songs users were uploading following action by Gema. In March, 2012 a second judgement told Rapidshare to be more proactive when hunting down content pirated by users.

    Music streaming site Grooveshark pulled out of Germany claiming licencing rates set by Gema made it impossible to run a profitable business in the country.

    Who knows where these will lead.

  4. #19
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Living part of the year in Germany I am witnessing first hand that LOTS of videos are banned from being viewed on YouTube because of Gema.
    While they seem to act on the musicians behalf, I think they actually hinder promotion and for consumers it is extremely annoying.

    As far as the original question goes: I too, turn almost entirely to YouTube, or sometimes for new music. I listen to radio only on rare occasions.
    I burn CDs only for selling at my gigs. I don't own CDs anymore. Younger people don't own CDs any more. Right now YouTube is THE hype. How this will develop in the next 5 years is hard to say. Nothing stays as it is.

  5. #20
    Retired Member Borys_Pomianek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    I sometimes don't listen even to free stuff.

    The smalls website is fucking amazing and I still keep forgetting about it.

    I guess it's because I like to stick to a few recordings for months or years rather than skim on the outlines of all the stuff there is.

    Youtube has loads of really cool stuff from the past. I have enough Oscar Peterson to not care about what is going on now most of the day.

    I think that jazz should be a local thing, where local people are interested in the local scene and then for touring to take place, exchange of ideas - from time to time when there is something hefty to exchange.
    A record is only there as a side order of some hot live and local music with the sprinkle of a an act coming from out of town.

    It's the same reason why I'm not into watching sport. Why would I cheer for the team from my town when all the players are from around the world, the sponsors are international companies and I can watch any match from anywhere in the world at a flip of a button. I end up watching no sport and not talking or being interested in it.
    There are other reasons for that - political mostly but I could imagine being into local teams if they where really local and there was a true connection.
    I would be into that as much as being into my local bakery.

    Sometimes however the time is ripe for extreme pleasure listening and then I just scoop it up and trip out on some good records. Then however I tend to pick what is the best fix and most often than not, it's some dead dude on a record.

    Things need to really catch my attention nowadays. Everything is shinny and everything is matte - "a little bit cheesy but it's nicely displayed" - does not work for me, I have a filter for that setup.

    I go with "classical" when I'm in my tired slumber and can only really reach for good jazz when I'm ready to rock the boat.
    This modern life is making it unfeasible to sit on that edge for most of the week.

  6. #21
    Guitarist/Oudist/Composer jazz oud's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Brooklyn, NY
    I don't think there is any question that, in general, radio is a more effective way of getting people interested in your music than youtube.

    I know someone who got interviewed on a public radio station here for about a minute, they played one song. That sold around a thousand copies of the album within 48 hours. Radio is mass media, the "mass" means that lots of people are paying attention to it.

    However, it's pretty difficult to get much radio exposure, and it's very easy to get youtube exposure--it's a (mostly) level playing field. So promoting oneself though youtube is usually going to be a more practical and effective approach, per hour spent, than trying to get on the radio.

  7. #22
    Retired Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    thanks for that feedback, jazz oud

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