Relationship between reading music and developing a musical "ear"

[Roy Burton]

To what extent does the ability to read music inhibit the development of a musical ear.

[El Gaucho]

i dont see how one thing has to do with the other?

[solarjazzband]

To be able to sing music from paper, and after that, hear the music in your head while reading the music.

[bubber]

It's about developing your musical ear, which you do best listening and trying to play what you hear. Jazz education for young people with brass band experience up here very often start without any written music - pupils have to learn the tunes and their parts by ear, learning to "feel" the periods and the basic harmonic foundation,

Which does'nt mean being able to read music is a disadvantage - it should not, however, obstruct ear training.

[monk]

To what extent does the ability to read music inhibit the development of a musical ear?

To no extent.

The process has to be:

1) I see something on paper.

2) I hear in my head (in high or low accuracy) how it would sound.

3) Based on this perception in my head, I play it.

Many people think it's a shortcut to leave out step 2. That's the danger, and possibly you mean that. Because one can't play convincing music if he doesn't "mean" it (i.e. "hears" it). It's like reading chinese poetry: It makes only sense if I know the meaning of the words. And the connotations of the words.

But perhaps you are one of these people who look for an excuse for not learning to read because "it spoils the musical ear"? Then go ahead, lazybones, and learn to read music instead of posting such questions ;-)

Best Wishes,
Monk

[Phil Kelly]

Nice post , Monk!

To continue, "reading music " should in fact ENHANCE ones "ears" ..providing you use the skill as in described in step #2 above..

Written music and the ability to read it rapidly and accurately , while not ruining ones ability to render music by ear, will definitely enhance your progress as a player and/or composer ..by making information more readily avaiable to you , and to give you material you can analyse and learn from.

i.e. I basically learned what I know about writing for orchestra by reading the scores of the masters while listening to recordings. I did NOT get much from so called "orchestration" texts ..

this practice , in turn eventually led me to be able to write away from a keyboard by using MY EAR to "hear" what I was putting on paper.

my .02 worth

[Roy Burton]

I agree with the message from Monk. But it is not only about hearing a tune and playing it without music. It is also about hearing compatable notes with each note of the melody, so that, in my case I play trombone, I can play a note which fits the chord pattern and doesn't clutter up the trumpet line. I don't know how it happens, but I can "hear" the notes which fit (the other notes of the chord), without neccessarily knowing what the chord is called. This is an automatic process and happens without thought.

[Phil Kelly]

Originally posted by Roy Burton
I agree with the message from Monk. But it is not only about hearing a tune and playing it without music. It is also about hearing compatable notes with each note of the melody, so that, in my case I play trombone, I can play a note which fits the chord pattern and doesn't clutter up the trumpet line. I don't know how it happens, but I can "hear" the notes which fit (the other notes of the chord), without neccessarily knowing what the chord is called. This is an automatic process and happens without thought.

The process you describe falls into the area of jazz theory ..which , again would bemore readily available to you if you could read the examples ..and then "relate " them to your playing ..regardless of your instrument ..

get a copy of Mark Levines " Jazz Theory" ..it is direct , to the point , and doesn't bog you down wwith those legit bits that everyone found so boring in the old days

[Tenorman]

I take the point Roy, but being unable to read is a severe restriction on your development as a musician. Let's say I bring a score in and none of the band can read the dots. Where do we go from there?

In the early days of Jazz the readers were probably in the minority, but then Jazz was simpler from the chord point of view.

If no-one in the band can read, then the chord structure of any tune will remain relatively simple. And how do you write your own stuff - or do you intend copying everything off albums?

[bubber]

I've been told (from a musician who played with him), that Chet Baker knew almost nothing about chords, he could hardly read music - so maybe there are no definite truths in this field either?

[monk]

Sorry Roy, but I don't understand. What's your point?

Now you talk about improvising. That you are able to improvise by ear is really fine and an advantage over other beginners, but what is the relation to reading music?

You really seem to want to rationalize your aversion against learning to read by saying that playing just by ear is "better" - why waste time with "worse" things?

Go on with playing only by ear - but don't complain one day because you get too few calls for gigs because you can't read (or sightread!) a chart.

As a trombonist, you will have fewer gigs than say, a pianist or saxophonist, anyway - so beware!

Best Wishes,
Monk

[Phil Kelly]

Whats that old gag about "What is a Trombonist with a pager? ..an optimist"

[Roy Burton]

Thanks Phil Kelly for the advice about the Mark Levine book. I have located a copy on ebay and ordered it. Just as well I don't play the banjo you could all have a real laugh.

As a matter of interest, I played 35 paying gigs over the last two months. Not bad for a simple trombonist. How many gigs did you guys play? Incidentall, I play a real trombone, not the fancy kind with the trigger or that trumpet players apology with the valves.

I used to think that the saxophone must be difficult to play, all those keys and rods and lots of squinting at the reed and fiddling with the mouthpiece, so about three years ago I bought one and started to learn. Had I realised how simple it is to play I might have taken it up years ago. I am sure that they are made to look complicated just to impress simple trombone players like me.

[bubber]

The saxophone is easy to play, but hard to play well.

[Phil Kelly]

Originally posted by Roy Burton
Thanks Phil Kelly for the advice about the Mark Levine book. ..
As a matter of interest, I played 35 paying gigs over the last two months. Not bad for a simple trombonist. How many gigs did you guys play? .

You're welcome about the Levine Book ...

But think now many MORE (and maybe better paying gigs )you'd have if you became a fluent sight reader on your horn ..the world of show, radio, telly, and recording would become a possibility you're self limiting yourself from as things stand ..Hmmmm ?